Italify – now available
A while back, I made an initial post about my newest tool: Italify. Today, after lots of additional development, Italify is out of the service model and can be directly installed and used in Glyphs.
The plugin allows you to generate optically corrected obliques in a fraction of the time you’d usually spend, at very high quality. From my experience with many clients who used the service, it can get you up to 95% of the way to the final oblique, depending on the design and your taste.
Italify can currently be licensed per week (unlimited masters) or per master (unlimited time). Contact me for custom licences (monthly, yearly…). The current pricing is deliberately aimed at foundries working on custom jobs, as a way to trial the plugin and workflow, collect feedback and improve the algorithm.
A handbook, a fully functional free trial (48h), licensing information and a Python API documentation are all available on the website.
I’m happy to give demos and introductions in person (Paris/Berlin/London) or by video, just contact me.
Comments
-
Cool! The site has some nice animated examples too, to help visualize.
Maybe I've overlooked something, and know it's early, but curious about any thoughts on its potential for serif designs?0 -
You can try it on your serif design. Technically, it's possible – Italify doesn't know what kind of design you have, it only sees path segments. You could run it on icons, if you wish.
Whether it really makes sense for your design is a different question, and the results are definitely not what one would normally expect for a true serif italic.
Italify "only" corrects the distortion of slanted shapes, it doesn't change anything about the fundamental design.
I'd be curious to see what you end up using it on!1 -
Gotcha. Thanks for your feedback and thoughts!0
-
That looks super useful! The price is a bit steep for my level of type design, unfortunately.0
-
Yes, I'm sorry about that. For the time being, this pricing is intentionally steep, as it is aimed at larger foundries with time pressure (or ridiculous amounts of masters to process). I want to keep the user group small, so that I can react to feedback and bug reports sensibly, before potentially rolling it out on a larger scale.
I will be transparent and say that I don't think a general one-time purchase is fair when licensing to big foundries. My reference (in terms of time saved and quality delivered) is iKern, which has operated on a similar model for ages. I still need to figure out how to do that, while also offering cheap one-time (?) purchases for the more general public.
You are more than welcome to 1) try the 48h trial, and 2) get in touch with me directly to negotiate a (much) smaller fee. I'm not a complicated guy in that regard, promise.1 -
I haven’t tried it yet, but Sebastian used it as a service to italify two masters for me, and it was, as he says, “95%” —which is all that one can expect anyway, given the idiosyncrasies of “design and taste.”0
-
Thank you very much for corroborating my pretentious claim, Nick!
0 -
With the per-master credit pricing model, does this continue to work when a master is extended? For example, if I have a Latin master, use Italify with it, then add Cyrillic later: can I apply Italify to the new Cyrillic portion of the master with the same credit?0
-
Yes, that's the idea. You licence a master once and can use Italify on it perpetually, no matter whether you add glyphs to it or whatever else.
You can also cheat the system by adding your entire library into one master, running Italify and then splitting the file again. But I like to trust my users
2 -
+1 on how good Sebastian's process is, he Italified two masters for me and it saved me so much time and (importantly) mental load. I was really hoping the plugin would be priced similar to something like Kern On, but understand why it isn't. Congrats on getting to this stage Sebastian!Nick Shinn said:I haven’t tried it yet, but Sebastian used it as a service to italify two masters for me, and it was, as he says, “95%” —which is all that one can expect anyway, given the idiosyncrasies of “design and taste.”
0 -
Thank you very much, David!
I plan on implementing a pricing based on foundry size, but there are a lot of open questions.
Regarding Kern On/RMX: I quite simply think that those plugins are far, far too cheaply priced compared the the immense value they provide, especially to larger foundries.
Again, feel free to get in touch with me, usually even just a "Hello" by mail will make me hand out massive discounts
1 -
David Sargent said:
+1 on how good Sebastian's process is, he Italified two masters for me and it saved me so much time and (importantly) mental load. I was really hoping the plugin would be priced similar to something like Kern On, but understand why it isn't. Congrats on getting to this stage Sebastian!Nick Shinn said:I haven’t tried it yet, but Sebastian used it as a service to italify two masters for me, and it was, as he says, “95%” —which is all that one can expect anyway, given the idiosyncrasies of “design and taste.”+1. I’ve been working with Sebastian for several years now, and I intend to continue doing so. We’ve already discussed the pricing of Italify, and for the time being I’ve decided to leave the obliques process to him. The quality of his work has always been excellent.
0 -
From a larger foundry’s perspective (I guess?), I’ll be honest that this pricing seems very high. If we scale the weekly to biweekly discount further, we’d get to a yearly cost of around €11,000, or more realistically probably somewhere between that and the unscaled €30k.
That can pay for a whole lot of italics production work by a salaried employee. I agree that RMX and KernOn are rather cheap for what they achieve. But it does feel like you probably overshot the target a bit with your pricing. I’m sure we’ll test the trial at some point (even if just out of curiosity), but I think if we invest that kind of money we’d rather work with a human who can do things other than italics
Either way, I wish you all the success with this! Always good when people create new options for everyone. Just wanted to add my perspective.
Just adding that I did read that this is testing pricing and you’ve priced it like this for specific reasons, but we don’t love changing our process over and over again, so usually we’d test and then either commit or not. So maybe your pricing will become more fitting for our needs, or not—totally understand that we might not be the target foundry for this.6 -
Thank you everyone for your great feedback, I really appreciate it.
Admittedly, the master licences are based on the service pricing I had, which people told me was pretty cheap.
If somebody wants to say (this is your chance to shape the pricing to your advantage!):
What would a sensible rate be? Bearing in mind that I would like to keep the time-based plus master-based licensing model. Would a monthly or yearly licence be interesting?
Very happy to hear your thoughts and adjust the pricing accordingly. Thanks a lot!1 -
Re. the pricing, I understand where you are coming from in terms of the plugin use license being related to the price of the service, but that means separating the value of the tool from the value of your labour in some way. If I use the plugin, rather than paying you to use the plugin, I am doing the labour part. I don’t have a sense of how much work is involved in things like structure tagging, so can’t say whether the license pricing is reasonable independent of the labour.I suspect it feels odd to some people to have a plugin cost more than the app in which it runs, but in general the pricing of font tools is weird.1
-
Yes. I agree on the notion that the pricing for the service can't be a direct indicator of the price of just the plugin.
In all transparency: the labour involved in processing a font is pretty minimal. As you will see from the handbook, there is a tagging process involved, which you do for one single master (per set of compatible masters). Then you just run the plugin once on all masters. For a project with around 200 paths, I would estimate about an hour end-to-end, independent of master count.
Learning the tagger interface is a bit of one-time work, of course. I will record some video material to go through a typical workflow, once I have some time.
I could also simply go back to offering it solely as a service (like iKern), which frankly would be a very comfortable goldmine, but I 1) don't want to spend my days doing only that, and 2) wanted to respond to the demand of people asking for the plugin directly.
If anybody wants to share some concrete numbers in regards to pricing, I'd be very happy to hear from you. Thanks!1 -
Interesting plugin. A lifetime license of around €99 would seem more realistic. Most foundries don't develop italics regularly, and those that do already have established workflows. In FontLab 8, for example, Briem’s method can be implemented by creating an Action that combines multiple commands, with good results—especially for rounded glyphs.Compared to something like Kern-On, this is a much more niche product with a considerably smaller audience.2
-
I would buy it if it's around €100 for lifetime. If you want to reach very small-scale designers who have limited means to produce typefaces, (have limited money to hire people to do the technical jobs already, they have to do everything themselves), this price is affordable and will help their workflow to be able to reduce the tedious work making italic. and i think with this price you will have many sales, although it's probably not the price you aim for...
Of course bigger companies should pay more, this pricing is not for them.1 -
That's my main issue. How do I offer licences to individual designers at an affordable rate while also selling enterprise licences to big foundries? They could simply buy the cheap option (or their in-house designers use their personal licences), there's no way for me to enforce this.
So I'm currently starting from the other end: enterprise licences first. Individual licences on request (again – simply reach out to me, I'm more than happy to negotiate a considerably cheaper licence for smaller foundries).
By the way, concerning the "established workflows", I'm well aware of this, but these workflows fall extremely short of the results Italify delivers. Especially concerning speed. Example: I recently ran the 60+ masters of Roboto Delta through Italify (quadratic outlines!) – in three minutes, on my MacBook Air. That's three seconds per master. This doesn't even take into account that Italify also corrects diagonals, which I don't think any other algorithm does
2 -
How about a one-time, per family rate that is reasonable?1
-
What do you mean by "per family"? Per file (font family)? Surname (family business foundry)?
This is impossible to do technically, in a sensible way. A family could be many masters, and/or spread over several files.
I think gauging the scope by master count makes the most sense. I price the service by that, additionally taking into account the path count. I'm already leaving the latter out for the plugin price, only calculating based on the master count, which I think is a sensible balance between accurate scope and simplicity.
0 -
As a potential user, I have to view the cost of your product in correlation to what profit I might make from adding an italic font to a family. In my experience, oblique fonts sell far less than their upright version. If the cost of your service is so much that it nearly absorbs the profit, I am not seeing the value in purchase. This may well be because I am a one-person shop. Perhaps there is a price model you can come up with for those of us running small foundries?1
-
Quick note: I don't understand what the "Disagree" reactions are for – what part do you disagree on? That master count is not a sensible way of gauging project scope?
Chris: Yes, absolutely, I understand that, and it is my main concern. I would like to make this financially fair to both parties (the foundry selling the oblique, but also the tool developer facilitating it, i.e. myself).
For the time being, as I said, my goal is precisely to cater to large foundries, and not (yet) smaller ones/individuals, so pricing is currently achieving its goal. Multiple foundries are very happy with the pricing, and I of course hear the feedback of those that are not, and I will adjust accordingly. It's a very tricky thing to price well, as I'm now learning.
Thanks again everybody for all the insight.1 -
For us smaller foundries, pricing per master still seems overly expensive. I would much prefer to see a per family price like Chris mentioned. I understand what you're going for, and it looks like a great tool, but as it stands, I'll probably just check back in at a later date to see where you've arrived with a public-facing pricing structure that takes into account the financial realities of smaller shops.0
-
That's my main issue. How do I offer licences to individual designers at an affordable rate while also selling enterprise licences to big foundries? They could simply buy the cheap option (or their in-house designers use their personal licences), there's no way for me to enforce this.This is the same problem every foundry faces when selling fonts. You pretty much have to trust people to do the right thing. In your case you’re selling a niche product to a niche audience, there’s not a lot of scope for people to take the piss.
1 -
I know this is an annoying question… but do you have plans to develop it for RoboFont? It looks really good!0
-
Congratulations on launching this, Sebastian! Pricing a font tool is basically impossible, but you can try different approaches over time. What matters most is what you’ve built—which is clearly sophisticated, well-designed, and deeply informed by your experience as a font engineer. Bravo! I look forward to seeing where this goes!1
-
Hi Kris, I very much would like to sell that way, and hopefully I can figure that out. In any case, I will keep you (all) updated when a better pricing solution is ready.
Regarding Robofont: This is very difficult, I'm afraid. I talked with Just and Frederik, and the main concern is simply that Italify is written in Swift (translating 30k+ lines of Swift isn't an afternoon's work). Two major concerns arise from the Python-based plugin: For one, it is much easier for somebody to reverse-engineer the algorithm, as Python is not a compiled language. Second, Python is ridiculously slow (as is Robofont, since it's written in Python). The first version of Italify was written in Python, my "native" programming language, but once I translated it to Swift, it ran close to 40 times faster. Those speed gains are just not doable in Python. Then there is the question of the UI and metadata, on which Italify builds heavily. Those possibilities don't exist in the same way in Robofont, I'm afraid, as Frederik told me.
All in all, it would be a huge undertaking and necessitate maintaining a completely separate code base. It is honestly not something I can picture doing in the near future, as much as I would like to offer the possibility.
I would honestly just spin up Glyphs, load the UFO(s) there and do the italifying once in Glyphs. For the Roboto Delta project I mentioned, I worked with a headless Glyphs setup and processed everything programmatically. There's just the tagging you need to do once for one master. Think of it as an external processing tool to put your UFOs through, you can stay in Robofont otherwise. A few Robofont-based designers are already using it this way.
And thank you very much for your kind words, Peter!7 -
Mini update, the plugin now works in Glyphs 4 and is available directly from the plugin manager.
Other minor update: a 48h trial now starts when you actually enter the code, not when you request the code. Sorry about that initial behaviour.0 -
The question is: What makes your plugin significantly better than the new Slanter filter included in Glyphs 4?0
Categories
- All Categories
- 47 Introductions
- 4K Typeface Design
- 495 Type Design Critiques
- 579 Type Design Software
- 1.1K Type Design Technique & Theory
- 672 Type Business
- 888 Font Technology
- 29 Punchcutting
- 540 Typography
- 125 Type Education
- 333 Type History
- 82 Type Resources
- 113 Lettering and Calligraphy
- 33 Lettering Critiques
- 80 Lettering Technique & Theory
- 569 Announcements
- 100 Events
- 116 Job Postings
- 170 Type Releases
- 182 Miscellaneous News
- 270 About TypeDrawers
- 54 TypeDrawers Announcements
- 114 Suggestions and Bug Reports













