Can the crossbar in Ħ be lowered?

James Puckett
James Puckett Posts: 1,993
in Technique and Theory
The crossbar and bar mark in Ħ can blend together at small sizes or at a distance, especially in heavy weights. Is it acceptable to lower the crossbar of H so there’s more room for space between the two bars?
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Comments

  • Chris Lozos
    Chris Lozos Posts: 1,458
    also, it should align with lowercase
  • Alex Kaczun
    Alex Kaczun Posts: 163
    Yes, absolutely. It's common practice. 10 units lower on cap H crossbar will look like you didn't even move it down, visually. The heavier the weight... lower crossbar even more and take off even more weight on crossbar & bar mark.

    It's all whatever works visually.
  • Craig Eliason
    Craig Eliason Posts: 1,436
    Chris Lozos said:
    also, it should align with lowercase
    ? What should align with lowercase?
  • Paul Hanslow
    Paul Hanslow Posts: 173
    Other glyphs can often be tweaked when a horizontal bar is introduced:

    the arch of the h on the /ħ(h bar) is often dropped to fit the bar comfortably, especially in serif typefaces so the bar doesnt clash with the ascenders serif. I've seen some cases where people just omit the ascender's flag serif.

    the same can apply to the /đ (d with stroke) also.
  • Christian Thalmann
    Christian Thalmann Posts: 1,983
    I tend to realize the glyph as a double-barred /H/. Come to think of it, I should probably ask a Maltese person whether that's readable, someday...
  • Craig Eliason
    Craig Eliason Posts: 1,436
    Hmm, I always assumed the bar should extend past the posts, even in a sans.
  • Chris Lozos
    Chris Lozos Posts: 1,458
    ? What should align with lowercase?
    the lowercase hbar and dcroat

  • Andreas Stötzner
    Andreas Stötzner Posts: 792
    Christian Thalmann said:
    … a double-barred /H/. ...

    I have seen a reference for this solution once in a book. Havn’t got it at hand right now. But I would also be interested in some background information about this.
    Would be even better to go to Malta directly I suppose … alas!
  • Craig Eliason
    Craig Eliason Posts: 1,436
    Chris Lozos said:
    ? What should align with lowercase?
    the lowercase hbar and dcroat

    Interesting, I’ve never thought of that alignment as important. And the design-specific demands of lowercase (amount of ascender space, character of ascender serif) seem so particular that placement of that bar often has little leeway, but those demands are absent (replaced by others) in the cap.  

     
    These (from Wikipedia, is that Arial and TNR?) don’t align. It does seem like you could lower the lowercase serif bar to match, though that serif cap bar feels high to me. And in the sans you’d have to raise the cap bar to match, and I think that would feel too high too. 
    This would be even trickier in one of the many typefaces with low cap heights (vs. ascender heights). 
  • Chris Lozos
    Chris Lozos Posts: 1,458
    I find the Ariel and TNR solutions you have shown awkward. Again, this is a preference to me, not a rigid rule.

    Also, as Paul Hanslow said above: "the arch of the h on the /ħ(h bar) is often dropped to fit the bar comfortably, especially in serif typefaces so the bar doesnt clash with the ascenders serif."

  • Christian Thalmann
    Christian Thalmann Posts: 1,983
    That cap and LC juxtaposition never happens in text anyway, right? Except when listing the letters of the alphabet. 

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